Obama Rallies in Opposite Corners

21 09 2008

Mudflatters from the ‘upper left’ corner of the U.S. and the ‘lower right’ corner of the U.S. had similar missions this weekend.  They turned out, each in their own way, to support the Obama campaign. 

The small gathering of about 24 Valley residents that gathered last week decided to meet again.  This time their numbers grew to more than 70!

Meanwhile, in Florida, Barack Obama himself wowed a packed house of thousands.  Now how can we get Barack Obama to come to Alaska??  He could gather a crowd that would dwarf the Pro-Palin rally easily.  I’m just saying…

So, here’s to AnnieNygmaAK in Wasilla, Alaska,  and Lynore in Miami, Florida, and thanks for being out there in the trenches, and sharing your pictures with the rest of your Mudbuddies!

 


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175 responses

21 09 2008
tamarack

Obama is speaking forcefully to the Wall St. crisis (otherwise known as the Big Shitpile.) I can’t wait to hear Sarah Palin’s solution.

21 09 2008
Georgia peach

Palin’s response: I have money in my wallet; therefore, I know how to fix the economy.

21 09 2008
ANONYMOUS

Now that’s brave!!!!! Wasilla??? I am very proud of people who turn out in Wasilla. I’m sure some people would be willing to drive out from Anchorage if we knew of it. I had some King’s donuts last week and I wouldn’t mind driving out there.
My understanding is that they will do this every Friday from 4-6. Any Wasillans out there that can verify this? AKM

21 09 2008
darkcorners

I can’t say this enough…we need millions of citizens to email or call their senators and congress reps and tell them NO BLANK CHECK.
This is so serious that we need to take a break from the campaign and address this problem. The democrats have got to find their voice and stand up to the power brokers. Let us show them we are with them. Overwhelm the telephones load the emails don’t stop until they know that we are watching and we will not let this slide.
Maybe we need to form a human chain and circle the Capitol
and let them know the people have had enough. NO BLANK CHECK, NO ABSOLUTE POWER TO THE PRES, NO MORE TRASHING OF THE CONSTITUTION.

21 09 2008
Divatalk

I’ve just looked at some of the reviews of Sarah Palin in FL. MSNBC indicates there were several thousand people. She did her standard speech with some variation to include the economic crisis from last week. She did not take questions from audience or reporters.

People were enthusiastic. They didn’t really have any concrete reason except they liked her.

Meanwhile, Joe Biden was in FL with a couple of thousand people. He answered questions from audience and reporters

Tell me again why everyone keeps saying the American people are smart?

21 09 2008
eajphd Molten Contra Palin

Way to go ! I think Wasilla probably had a higher turn out as percentage of population than the rallies in Florida. It’s an indication of really strong feelings.

21 09 2008
Mainiac

OFF TOPIC:
I just came from the Obama sign watch. Troll came in and started hurling insults like saying “obama is gay” 100xs. This is not only infuriating but uncovers yet another prejudice that has been institutionalized by government and churches, i.e. homophobia.
As an aging lesbian I am so HOPING that this younger generation will turn the corner on this. I’m doing all that I can but it seems like it is worse than it was 25 yrs ago.

21 09 2008
eajphd Molten Contra Palin

Divatalk (18:30:33) :

I think the headline from MSNBC says it all “Palin’s first Fla. campaign stop a safe one”

Biden isn’t looking for safe spots, he’s going where there are undecided voters not to a booster club. So don’t let the surface impressions get you down.

Rember McCain & Co have already equated large rallies with Nazis tactics in criticizing Obama for going to Berlin. They have clearly adopted Goebbel’s dictum of telling a big lie so often that it sticks – now they are simply following through on that logic and adopting Goebbel’s of trying to impress people with the “inevitability” of their victory through staging mass rallies of supporters to “whip up the base” – it’s really base.

21 09 2008
C

Hey Teach,

I got banned from viewing your video stream. Did the troll do this to me? I can’t get back in! 😦

21 09 2008
eajphd Molten Contra Palin

Editorial correction – boy I really do need my glasses

Remember McCain & Co have already equated large rallies with Nazis tactics in criticizing Obama for going to Berlin. They have clearly adopted Goebbel’s dictum of telling a big lie so often that it sticks – now they are simply following through on that logic and adopting Goebbel’s tactic of trying to impress people with the “inevitability” of their victory through staging mass rallies of supporters to “whip up the base” – it’s really base.

21 09 2008
sauerkraut

Funny how Palin never takes questions, isn’t it? Is she afraid someone will discover that she knows squat about economics or business? Or perhaps she’s afraid someone might point out that the political campaign of an Arizoner has taken over the governor’s office in Alaska?

Joe Biden’s sister is speaking to some democratic group in the eastern section of central pennsyltucky (lotsa bitter people clutching their guns and wishing they could shoot wildlife from hellee copters around here) on Tuesday evening but it’s already overbooked. Joe’s sister is taking questions. But Palin isn’t. Ain’t that just odd. Of what is Palin afraid??

Cannot join you peeps on the webcam forum thingie… seems trolls (the “truth” squad, perhaps?) have taken it over.

21 09 2008
eajphd Molten Contra Palin

Editorial correction – boy I really do need my glasses

rember should be Remember and the second Goebbel’s should be Goebbel’s tactic

21 09 2008
sauerkraut

Hey Mainiac… which county you in?

21 09 2008
eajphd Molten Contra Palin

Sorry I got a double post warning and thought the second post wouldn’t go up.

21 09 2008
Theresa

I just love those home made Alaskan signs!

21 09 2008
Divatalk

I watched John McCain and Barack Obama on 60 minutes. It was really good to watch both of them in that type of forum.. Really looking forward to the debates.

Maybe it’s just me, but every time I watched Obama talk, I like him more and more. It drives me nuts when I see the polls or hear people say “I don’t like him because he is black” or I won’t vote for him because he is black”. It really makes you wonder. My question to them is, “if you were drowning and the only one around to give you a lifesaver was a black person, would you take it?

If they don’t vote for him because he is black, they are voting against themselves, not him. First, he is bi racial, so you are voting against a white person as well as a black person. But more importantly, if you blindfold yourself and listen to what he is saying and agree that what he is proposing is the best for you, you are taking away a vote for a better life for you and your family.

Think about it. He is a US Senator, a bestselling author, a historical public figure beloved by millions around the world. IF he does not win, though he may be upset, he will be okay. But will you? Who will be the real loser here? He has made a huge mark and will live on to either run again or continue a successful career. He will be able to write a ticket to whatever he wants to do.

Where will you be? If you elect John McCain and Sarah Palin, where will you be 4 years or 8 years from now? If you honestly believe their policies work best for you, then by all means vote for them. But if you are voting for them exclusively because you don’t want to vote for a “Black man”, then shame on you for taking away the possibilities for you and your family to have a successful life.

Just think about it!

21 09 2008
Anonymous

How wonderful, almost triple from last week. Just a thought, on Friday Oct 31st (when the crowd is massive) I would love to see some witch’s hats and broomsticks.
RIP Bushco

21 09 2008
RW

And tomorrow – Monday, sept 22, we are having a rally in Denver, at the steps of the capital. Hope to see lots of mudflats there!

http://www.progressnowaction.org/page/s/KissGoodbye

Send pictures Colorado Mudflatters! AKM

21 09 2008
RW

Here’s an interesting article my sister just sent me:
http://www.newsweek.com/id/160080/page/1

21 09 2008
Suchanut

Diva – I agree!

I love Barack – OBAMA 2008!

21 09 2008
DeMo

No matter how many times I see pics of people coming together for Obama/Biden, I still get the chills.

It’s the first time in my life that I’ve seen people so excited by a candidate. (46-years-old.) It’s the first time *I* have been so excited by a candidate.

Folks, we get the administration we choose, so we have to be heard. If you can’t make it to a rally, volunteer with the campaign. If you can’t volunteer, dig into your pocket and make a donation. If you can’t afford a donation, VOTE. Make your voice heard.

darkcorners (18:28:38) said:

I can’t say this enough…we need millions of citizens to email or call their senators and congress reps and tell them NO BLANK CHECK.
This is so serious that we need to take a break from the campaign and address this problem. The democrats have got to find their voice and stand up to the power brokers. Let us show them we are with them.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
darkcorners is right. Get in touch with your senators and congressional representatives. Doesn’t matter where you live and if you think your reps are Republican. Let them know how you feel.

Tell them that Bush’s proposed legislation (the bailout) may be necessary, but the proposed unprecedented power that will be given to the Secretary of the Treasury is unacceptable. It bypasses checks and balances, one of the cornerstones of our democracy. The bill cannot be passed until the language of Section 8 is omitted or edited.

Here’s how to contact your reps:
http://www.visi.com/juan/congress (courtesy of “justina”)
http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm
https://forms.house.gov/wyr/welcome.shtml (courtesy of “darkcorners”)

“The Secretary is authorized to take such actions as the Secretary deems necessary to carry out the authorities in this Act, including, without limitation…”

“designating financial institutions as financial agents of the Government, and they shall perform all such reasonable duties related to this Act as financial agents of the Government as may be required of them”

“The Secretary may, at any time, exercise any rights received in connection with mortgage-related assets purchased under this Act.”

This is critical, folks. Without oversight, the Secretary can do ANYTHING. We’ve seen what people who can do anything are capable of doing. That’s why we’re in this fiscal mess. Absolute power? Never.

Just a quick note to your reps can make the difference. It’s the difference between the Secretary of the Treasury of having control over your wallet and you having control. Which would you prefer?

21 09 2008
Ripley_6 AKA Copper Catfish P.

OFF TOPIC
this is the link for the live streaming video of the Obama/Biden sign that keeps getting ripped off. I can get in ok.. so try again if you couldn’t before. We’re all a bit off kilter, I suspect, but it’s fun nonetheless. WE need a little fun.

http://www.ustream.tv/channel/obama-sign-cctv-1

21 09 2008
Mainiac

Sauerkraut:
I’m in Somerset County

21 09 2008
C

@Copper:

I keep trying to get in, but it says my address is banned. WTF?? I can view the video but I can join the chat. 😦

21 09 2008
TeachKids

C, son thinks he might have accidentally banned someone else (you) in his haste to ban the troll. He’s trying to correct it, but isn’t quite sure how. Taking suggestions.

21 09 2008
C

I mean *can’t* join the chat.

21 09 2008
C

Well, if you can undelete email addys, mine is the “pretty view with 9’s”. 😉

21 09 2008
Divatalk

Do you guys remember the movie “Network”. Where Peter Finch’s character a disgusted reporter/news personality got fed up with the TV Network system and proclaimed to his audience to “open your windows and scream out loud that you are mad as hell and you’re not going to take it anymore”. He rallied people to stand up to the networks and say STOP! Enough!

Well, what if we did that? What would it take for a national show of unity and solidarity to do something on a particular day, at a particular time to show we are a united front behind Obama/Biden. Whether it be honking of horns, or standing outside screaming at the top of our lungs we want Obama/Biden, or everyone calling into a news or radio station simultaneously, or something outrageous.

What do you think! If we take the energy from the people of Wasilla and other parts of Alaska and make it a national thing, I believe we could make a strong statement.

What do you think?

21 09 2008
Cartoon Pig Dog

Sarah’s not taking questions is, of course, no surprise. The GOP also changed the rules for the debates. The VP candidates will have less time to answer each question than the presidential candidates saying that giving them equal time would give biden an unfair advantage because he is a more experienced orater. The real reason is obvious, they want to give her less time to stick her foot in her mouth.

21 09 2008
sauerkraut

Mainiac – I’ve been there in Somerset County a few times. Is the Indian still up in Skow-he-gone? Graduated from hs in Fairfield.

21 09 2008
Engine Nighthawk Palin

Great photos!!!

21 09 2008
protus

LOL!!

Everyone takes questions except Falin.

Proof that she was not vetted and shes a crutch at best.

Anyhow McCain is getting madder and his eye is twitching even more I am expecting him to through a full blown fit here shortly.

As far as Falin?

Bah shes not worthy of any response from the campaign until she steps up and starts talking instead of just spewing out 3×5 card mantra.

21 09 2008
sauerkraut

Pig Dog – so what’s her problem? She’s got a pretty big mouth, even with the lipstink… so, is she afraid her foot won’t fit in there? If she’d turn around, I’ll happily give her mine right upside the keister.

21 09 2008
JJ

WHAT’S UP WITH THE GOV? SHE IS UNABLE TO SPEAK TO THE PRESS-SHE APPEARS TO NOT BE SHY WHEN SHE IS ON THE STUMP-IN FACT SHE MAKES AN IDIOT OF HERSELF-PERHAPS SHE IS A MUTE ROVE PLANTED A SPEAKER IN HER LYRNX THAT ACTIVATES WHEN SHE IS IN LARGE CROWDS OR WITH OTHER RIGHT WINGERS.
NEVER DO I DOUBT OBAMA/BIDEN! THEY WILL CHEW HER UP AND FED HER TO THE ALASKA DUDE!
HER VOICE MAKES ME WANT TO CRAWL RIGHT UP A WALL-KINDA LIKE NAILS ON A BLACKBOARD.

21 09 2008
protus

Oh her mouth is plenty big enough.

You give her enough time shell stuff the whole damn leg in it😀

21 09 2008
Divatalk

I think it’s hysterical. You say you are ready on day one to potentially be president, but you are not ready on day 23 to answer questions from anyone! It’s ludicrous.

21 09 2008
HamletsMill aka Rot Pipeline Palin

WOW! When you make the rules, you answer to no one! “Socialize risk. Privatize profits.”

Fed boosts support for Goldman and Morgan
Central bank okays change in status for last two remaining investment banks.

http://money.cnn.com/2008/09/21/news/companies/fed_investmentbanks.ap/index.htm
—————————————-

SoCal Bob. (06:17:14) said:

“I’m against all these bailouts. Why not go after all the CEOs who profited with those obscene bonuses first. Why not turn a few of their homes in the Hamptons they bought with bonuses over to the American people.”
—————————————–

How about a viral video or political ad of American families scurrying across the snow pack while investment bankers in helicopters lean out on the rails and shoot at them with high powered rifles? With this we get the voice over of McCain’s and Palin’s insipid economic statements as families scurry and shot after shot is taken.

In a second viral video or political ad, a Jimmy Stuart/Gary Cooper total frontiersman archetype trying to protect his family (how about even a buckskin fringed jacket too!) seeking cover inside a tree line takes steady aim and shoots back at the hunting helicopter with his rifle. The helicopter is hit and starts to stutter out of control. The pilot struggles with the controls. Two investment banker CEO’s smoking cigars holding their rifles say “Hey. Don’t look at us for any help, we’ve got golden parachutes. Hahaha” They bail out to safety as we follow the helicopter into the ground. Voice over. “I’m John McCain and I approve this message.”

-HM

21 09 2008
Cassie Jeep Pike Palin (Wish I were Trout)

Wasilla women rock the UNIVERSE! And the men that go with them change the world!

I would love to see Obama go into the wilderness with you!

Every week?

This deserves acclaim!

21 09 2008
U D

Can anyone explain why Sarah Palin can’t be subpeona’d @ the debate right before she steps on stage since she’s “LIED” again on cooperating in regards
to the troopergate investigation?

21 09 2008
Carlyle

McCain could not careless about this country. He will do whatever it takes to get elected.
Proof, choosing a VP, that is no where ready to lead anything. Not even her own state. As it has been taken over, by McCain Stooges. She can’t even answer questions. Why does the Republican Party, not care?

21 09 2008
HamletsMill aka Rot Pipeline Palin

Sarah Palin Vlog #6: BEFORE THE BIG SPEECH!

Gov. Palin Vlog #5: Sarah at the RNC!

21 09 2008
LJP aka Revolver Trooper

Yeah, “ludicrous” is the word. I am still trying to figure out how McCain can still be in the race at all. If Obama or Biden essentially took over a governor’s office, told state officials to ignore a legislature’s subpoenas, flip-flopped on the economy being “fundamentally sound” within hours of its near collapse, put one lying campaign ad on the air after another, continued to lie after being called out by the press, couldn’t remember how many houses they owned or tell the difference between Shia and Sunni–well, they would be 15 or 20 points down. If Obama had voted 90% of the time with Bush, he would be finished. And if Obama was joined at the hip with the guy who is responsible for deregulating the financial institutions that are now failing (Phil Gramm, McCain’s “former” chief economic advisor) every pundit it America would be saying that he is not fit to be president.

It’s not just McCain and Palin that don’t tell the truth. It’s the mainstream media.

We want answers: McCain must release his medical records. Palin must release medical records and tax records. McCain should answer questions about Phil Gramm’s role in his administration if elected. He should answer questions about his consistent records AGAINST any form of regulation. And that just for starters.

Somehow, the mainstream media

21 09 2008
LJP aka Revolver Trooper

Ignore that last part. It’s 11:31 here in the Burgh. The Steelers lost. And the cat brought a mouse in the house that has, somehow, escaped.

21 09 2008
Divatalk

Did you know that John McCain has 13 cars? So he has 7 homes, at least, 13 cars, 500 Armani shoes, and his wife spend over $700K per mo to Amex. And they Obama is elitist! Check out the blog from CNN. Listen to the audio from the President of auto workers.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/

21 09 2008
Mainiac

Sauerkraut:
The Indian is still in Skowhegan. I’m living in Pittsfield. Are you still in Maine?
I know there are others here from Miane but I don’t know who they are.

21 09 2008
Mainiac

Maine looks like it’s going blue this election season, though our senators are both republican and 1 is up for reelection.
This state has been very hard hit financially and it is getting worse.

21 09 2008
Cavegal

Off Topic, however since the latest bailout is turning into a major talking point I felt these thoughts I posted at Dancing With Fire are probably very appropriate:

When talking about the economy, especially Wall Street, it is interesting to see that the market rallied over 400 points just on the news that taxpayers will be bailing out corporations yet again. Specifically the newest AIG debacle. This is corporate socialism. Our tax dollars are being used to bail out companies that used BAD business judgement. They deserve to fail. Do they not understand that this is a capitalist economy where free market rules imply that the unprepared or poor judgement is rewarded with death? What does this say to the business’s that have practiced fiscal responsibility? Why should American taxpayers bail out companies that leveraged themselves at a rate of 30 to 1?

I am a registered Independent that is currently leaning toward Obama only because McCain has demonstrated a complete lack of understanding to what is important to middle class Americans. He has run an attack campaign that has provided no real platform of actionable policies that he will promote to help the American middle class.

What concerns me most about McCain is his incredibly arrogant and belligerent attitude. This man appears, in my humble opinion, to be somewhat psychotic in his behavior. A trait that may be desirable in a bomber pilot but is quite lacking for the premier leadership position of this country.

The rest of the world is watching as many of them have invested heavily in our country in an effort to keep it afloat financially. Now they are loosing money and know that they can no longer prop up the US $10 trillion debt. It is time to start tightening our belts and knuckling down to re-building this country with some tighter financial regulation.

The free market mantra hiding corporate socialism no longer works. I recently did a book review on David Cay Johnston’s “Free Lunch” that explains just how badly the American taxpayer is getting screwed. I highly recommend reading this work as it explains things in layman terms. Link below:

http://currentera.com/FreeLunch.html

21 09 2008
C

C aka Filter Skate Palin 😀

——-

Teach,

I still can’t get into the chat. 😦 I’m having withdrawal….! 😦

21 09 2008
HamletsMill aka Rot Pipeline Palin

Sarah Palin Vlog #9: CHURCH!

21 09 2008
TeachKids

C, I’m so sorry. We wrote an email to webmaster and will fix it as soon as we get a reply. Any chance you can use another computer? Son is really sorry.

21 09 2008
Eyes Wide Open in Pittsburgh

Hey Sauerkraut!

What is with the crack about “Pennsyltucky” ? Need I remind you that Pennsylvania was a proud blue state in both 2000 & 2004? Pennsylvania, by most projections, will be in the blue column again in 2008. O’bama’s comments in San francisco about Pennsylvanians clutching guns and bibles was unfortunate. He was frustrated that we went for Hillary in big numbers. Hillary lost the nomination. We are behind him and will vote blue again. So what state are you from Saurkraut?

21 09 2008
laurie

I just sent emails to Patty Murray and Maria Cantwell about no blanks checks. Then I logged in here. I agree on the gay issue. I was canvassing in Tacoma, Washington today and spoke with a lesbian mom. She said she feared that” “cheney palin” would come and take her child. We both laughed at her freudian slip.

Thanks for this wonderful site, I have been a lurker for a few weeks.

Thanks for de-lurking! AKM

21 09 2008
Enjay aka Turbine Yukon

lol @ LJP

My cats do that all the time –

21 09 2008
reveur1147

@divatalk — yes !! We need a declared Obama Day where we can make a HUGE national statement of solidarity — turn the whole country BLUE !! Let’s do it !

21 09 2008
C

Hey Teach,

Thanks for trying! There has to be a way to un-ban the email address or the IP address. Let me know what the webmaster comes back with. I created an account on that video site and you can email me there.

Thanks!!

21 09 2008
HamletsMill aka Rot Pipeline Palin

Governor Sarah Palin Vlog #15: SATAN!

Goodnight all!

21 09 2008
mvngfwd aka WMD Cessna

Watching Bill Maher on TIVO. Andrew Sullivan is raging on McCain/Palin. Then says verbatim…”Obama is the Future”!

21 09 2008
Divatalk

reveur1147. Great. Anyone have any idea what we can do and how to get this party started? Feedback please!

21 09 2008
Divatalk

reveur1147. We need to pick a day and then a statement of what we can do to show support. Then begin email campaign to everyone we know across the country to get the support.

21 09 2008
Cavegal

Mainiac (18:40:54) :
OFF TOPIC:
I just came from the Obama sign watch. Troll came in and started hurling insults like saying “obama is gay” 100xs. This is not only infuriating but uncovers yet another prejudice that has been institutionalized by government and churches, i.e. homophobia.

Maniac,

You are so not off topic to me! I am sick of rampant stupid homophobia and I’m straight!! I don’t care what people do behind closed doors in their own home! It appears to me that the only people this really bothers are the ones that are sexually frustrated and are pre-occupied with everyone but their own sex lives! They should grow up and start taking care of their baser needs! Obviously the lack of release is affecting their brains!!

21 09 2008
Susan in Atl

Is Sarah Palin qualified?

http://www.pbs.org/now/polls/poll-435.html

I’ve seen this link attempted twice but they copied the link after they had responded to the poll and it did not work. This link will take you to the poll.

21 09 2008
Eyes Wide Open in Pittsburgh

THANKS RW! http://www.newsweek.com/id/160080/page/1

The link you posted to the latest Newsweek article on Palin is great. Here is an except for everyone to enjoy:

“Still, the problem she poses to our political process is now much bigger than she is. Her fans seem inclined to forgive her any indiscretion short of cannibalism. However badly she may stumble during the remaining weeks of this campaign, her supporters will focus their outrage upon the journalist who caused her to break stride, upon the camera operator who happened to capture her fall, upon the television network that broadcast the good lady’s misfortune—and, above all, upon the “liberal elites” with their highfalutin assumption that, in the 21st century, only a reasonably well-educated person should be given command of our nuclear arsenal.”

21 09 2008
Susan in Atl

Oh, and by the way, the poll right now says 56% think she’s qualified…cough, cough.

Get in there! http://www.pbs.org/now/polls/poll-435.html

21 09 2008
Carlyle
21 09 2008
Carlyle

@Eyes Wide Open in Pittsburgh

a reasonably well-educated person should be given command of our nuclear arsenal.”

Let me see, would I want a reasonably educated person in command or someone who lives next to Russia as a qualification, to be in command? …hhhmmmmmm
I don’t know, I’m stumped…LOL

21 09 2008
Eyes Wide Open in Pittsburgh

Carlyle:

She could defend us from Russia. She has guns, her “first dude” has a plane and they can see Russia from her house. Heck it would be like shooting wolves from a copter.

21 09 2008
katiebegood

Ok folks, it is official. John McCain has officially gone bat shit crazy.

Interviewed on CBS today, however, McCain said he does not “regret” championing the deregulation of Wall Street:

http://thinkprogress.org/2008/09/21/mccain-deregulation/

21 09 2008
Bec in Illinois

I would love to find out who Cheney’s daughter is REALLY going to vote for this year. Puleeze. There is a big Baptist movement right now to prevent gays from adopting. And of course Sarah’s church must be having that Pray the Gay Away conference about right now. I still think those who shout the loudest have something big in their closet they are trying to hide! Life is too short for this much hate, I say.

21 09 2008
AnneinWA

Divatalk (18:48:59) :
I watched John McCain and Barack Obama on 60 minutes. It was really good to watch both of them in that type of forum.. Really looking forward to the debates.

Diva,
I also watched 60 Minutes and was pleased with the forum. HOWEVER, I was disappointed that when one reporter “followed” McCain, it was to Iraq, where they sat in bullet-proof vests, talking seriously about “the surge” (a clip from 2 ears ago). Then, when the other reporter “followed” Obama, it was to Elko, Nevada last Wednesday where they showed a bit of his speech (about McCain and economics), then spoke about how the tone of Obama’s speeches has become sharper recently. I realize I am sensitive to these kind of differences, but it seemed like a strange juxtaposition to me. Am I being too picky? McCain looked like he was doing serious business – just another campaign stump speech for Barack. Couldn’t they have at least shown Barack visiting the troops in Iraq? I know they have footage.

Possibly, my take on it was influenced by the grin on my Republican husband’s face – he was still moved (and so was I) by McCain opening the envelope that he said was handed to him, by a woman, as he arrived at the airport for the interview. He read the name and rank of the soldier who was killed in Afghanistan and a touching note from that soldier’s mother – then, he pulled out a “dog-tag” and held it up for us to see the young man’s picture. Also, later in the interview (from his Sedona,AZ home), McCain gave his pat answer to the question about where he has lived the longest – Hanoi.

All in all, I thought the questions posed to JMc were more serious and allowed him opportunities to speak about more serious matters such as his faith, his father’s life-long battle with alcoholism, how hard it was for his dad (the admiral) to “make the call” to bomb Hanoi, knowing his son was a prisoner there.

At the end, my husband said he thought Obama “came off fine” because “he can only work with what he has”. WHAT? I asked, my head whipping around violently. His response was that it’s not Obama’s fault that he hasn’t had to face many difficult situations in his life, he wasn’t a prisoner of war and possibly I am expecting too much of him since he hasn’t even been in the Senate very long! As Rachel Maddow would say, “Can you talk me down?” Am I simply looking for unequal treatment?

21 09 2008
sauerkraut

Eyes Wide – may I refer you to snakeface carville and his description of the section of pennsyltucky in which I live? I mean… I know it’s not Perry County in which I live but I can hear the banjos.

21 09 2008
sauerkraut

Annie – McCain proclaimed Iraq as “safe” two years ago, so why does he need a flack jacket and a battalion to protect him?

21 09 2008
Debbie aka Commando Coalfire Palin

McCain “The economy is fundamentally strong” Herbert Hoover in a speech given October 30, 1929 Two days after Black Thursday “Our economy is fundamentally strong, this will not last.” Of course we who have an elementry school history know Hoover was wrong.
I have blogged this before but I at the risk of being redundant I am down to 1/4 staff, my worldwide competitors are suffering equally be they in Taiwann or Ireland. Things are bad. The dam has sprung a leak and George has his finger in it what we are seeing is only what is escaping around said finger. He is trying to maintain a good economy so McCain can get elected then he will leave office pull his finger out and blame it on the next president. The fact that all these banks are failing and people are loosing their houses, unemployment here is at 8.7% BEFORE the election means there are alot of snakes and lizzards still waiting to slither out.

21 09 2008
pvazwindy

Hanoi? How about Phoenix for the last 28yrs.

21 09 2008
VP, Flat Earth Society

It drives me nuts when I see the polls or hear people say “I don’t like him because he is black” or I won’t vote for him because he is black”.
__________________

It never ceases to amaze me when I hear things like this. Are these people aware that they are just broadcasting for all the world to see and hear, just how pathetically ignorant they are. Why don’t we just insist that they must brand their foreheads with an “S” for Stupid, then we won’t have to waste our valuable time listening to their sad little commentaries.

21 09 2008
AnneinWA

sauerkraut (20:19:15) :
Annie – McCain proclaimed Iraq as “safe” two years ago, so why does he need a flack jacket and a battalion to protect him?

sauerkraut,
Good point!

pvazwindy (20:24:10) :
Hanoi? How about Phoenix for the last 28yrs.

pvazwindy,
THAT’S WHAT I SAID! I think I am starting to breathe again!

Thanks guys!

21 09 2008
AnneinWA

laurie (19:43:31) :
Are you registered at the forum? If so, I’ll contact you there. We may live near each other and I am looking for fellow Mudflatters in our area.

21 09 2008
Eyes Wide Open in Pittsburgh

YOU MUST WATCH THIS AND SEND IT TO EVERYONE WITH A BRAIN.

Most honest report I have ever seen in the mass media.

THANK YOU ABC!!!!!!!!

WOW!!!!!!!!!!!

21 09 2008
Bec in Illinois

Annie – my sympathies to you for having a divided household. My daughter does, but I couldn’t handle it. That said, your guy doesn’t sound nasty about it, so that is good. We have 40 some days to help you convince him!

If he is a reader and moved by things – have him read Obama’s “Dreams From My Father.” I just had to read one chapter and I had tears streaming at what a gifted man he is to be honest, explore human nature, struggle with his own identity, and then find his amazing, brilliant voice. (Yeah – I’m a goner).

I bought 4 copies of Audacity of Hope to share with family and have started to read it about 3 times – but I spend too much time on my computer and places like this to read books. But what I read so far assures me that his intelligence and ability to work with all types of people, and to not condescend to them, will help figure a lot out for our country and the world.

We can’t expect Obama to solve it all the first month. He will be accepting about the most difficult job a president has been handed since Lincoln (I think). People will start getting mad like they are at the Dem Congress for not improving things. But he is the man to get us through this!

21 09 2008
Kathy

ENOUGH with the pbs polls already!! As I was voting in the totally unscientific pbs polls (is Palin qualified, whom do you trust, McC or Obama), I smelt a rat, or several rats, and one of them was me! Like a GD lab rat, there I was pushing a button hoping to outvote the Freepers (Free Republic trolls) who have obviously spread the word (McC 70%, Obama 29%, unsure nothing???). I thought, I’m pushing the button, where’s my pellet?

Rather than participate in this idiotic, superficial, waste of time, I sent an e-mail to NOW telling them their poll was worthless, and I was disappointed and surprised that a serious news program would indulge in American Idol-style internet voting. How completely useless. Their poll was entirely Freeped. And our doing it doesn’t make it any better.
Here’s the link if you want to send them a crisp little comment:
http://www.pbs.org/now/feedback.html

21 09 2008
Divatalk

AnnieinWa (I don’t know how to italicize or bold my quotes, sorry)
“At the end, my husband said he thought Obama “came off fine” because “he can only work with what he has”. WHAT? I asked, my head whipping around violently. His response was that it’s not Obama’s fault that he hasn’t had to face many difficult situations in his life, he wasn’t a prisoner of war and possibly I am expecting too much of him since he hasn’t even been in the Senate very long! As Rachel Maddow would say, “Can you talk me down?” Am I simply looking for unequal treatment”

You let your husband know that Obama’s life, though it may not have been that of a POW, however to say he has not had to face many difficult situations, is extremely naive.

In Obama’s way, he was a POW of another type. His war was a racial one. And in that war he is still battling it. Only certain segments of our population understand what it is like to not fit in no matter where you go. For Obama, he didn’t fit as a white kid, he didn’t fit as a black kid, and he didn’t fit during his time in Indonesia or Hawaii for that matter. Each group came with it’s own set of issues and challenges to overcome. Not to mention in addition to not having a dad around and not being rich. John McCain does not understand that type of prison.

And as Obama has said his experience has left him with an understanding of many people from many places and allows him to connect with everyone not just the privileged few.

I don’t think it took away from their conversation based on McCain in Iraq and Obama in Nevada. McCain is known for war, Obama is known for the people. Each person will take away from it what they choose.

Last thing I will say is this. If McCain was so touched by the experience in Iraq, why did he initially not support the GI bill and why are our veterans returning home and not being taken care of and are homeless. That doesn’t sound like he cares very much for them to me.

21 09 2008
VP, Flat Earth Society

How about starting a national movement and call it “Obama Blue day” and wear blue to show support.

21 09 2008
Aussie Puck Mule Revlon Red Palin

I just noticed in the forum that John McCain is scheduled to speak in Scranton at 8.30 a.m. tomorrow morning.

Maybe someone who works near the cultural centre (and is still up!) can swing by and scope it out for us. I, for one, would be interested in knowing what manner of crowd he might pull at 8.30 Monday morning.

21 09 2008
Bec in Illinois

I have a wardrobe suggestion for any Mudflat rallies – check out the boots here:
http://www.like.com/shoes/yellow_rubber_boots?SID=GOO&CID=GESHO0c86f07d3472f2e6

I’m ready to order a pair and wear them with pride! There is the “Hunter” model – but I’d prefer the “Working Person” ones.

21 09 2008
ds55
21 09 2008
VP, Flat Earth Society

Eyes Wide Open in Pittsburgh (20:33:28) :

YOU MUST WATCH THIS AND SEND IT TO EVERYONE WITH A BRAIN.

Most honest report I have ever seen in the mass media.

THANK YOU ABC!!!!!!!!

WOW!!!!!!!!!!!

____________________

Thank you so much for posting this. It was the last sentence “John McCain showed us some of his personality this week and made some of us fearful”.
And that from a very conservative commentator! Wow.

21 09 2008
laurie

Off topic Reply to Annie

I tried to register for the forum the other day but for some reason could not get it to go through. I live in lakewood not but lived in Tacoma from 1990 to 2000.
Do you want to contact me directly?

21 09 2008
AnneinWA

Bec in Illinois (20:33:31) :
Annie – my sympathies to you for having a divided household. My daughter does, but I couldn’t handle it. That said, your guy doesn’t sound nasty about it, so that is good. We have 40 some days to help you convince him!

If he is a reader and moved by things – have him read Obama’s “Dreams From My Father.”

@Bec,
Election years are very difficult times for us, and I am SO passionate about this election. My guy is not mean about our differences – he simply looks at me and GRINS when I become a raving lunatic thinking that, after EIGHT YEARS of Bush/Cheney, he would even consider McCain! OMG! I sound like a pitbull with NO lipstick! SORRY FOR THE RANT!

Also, he is a reader and I have done everything but begged him to read “Dreams of My Father” – I was so moved by that book and have shared it with many. Like you, I am going to have to stay off this computer longer if I expect to finish “Audacity of Hope” Thanks for your support.

21 09 2008
Divatalk

VP, Flat Earth Society

How about starting a national movement and call it “Obama Blue day” and wear blue to show support.

I like that. or What about a blue t-shirt “It’s the Issues, STupid!! Vote Obama/Biden 08.

21 09 2008
HamletsMill aka Rot Pipeline Palin

AnneinWA (20:14:47) :

At the end, my husband said he thought Obama “came off fine” because “he can only work with what he has”. WHAT? I asked, my head whipping around violently. His response was that it’s not Obama’s fault that he hasn’t had to face many difficult situations in his life, he wasn’t a prisoner of war and possibly I am expecting too much of him since he hasn’t even been in the Senate very long! As Rachel Maddow would say, “Can you talk me down?” Am I simply looking for unequal treatment?
———————————————-

AnneinWA.

John McCain somehow thinks HE is the ONLY person in the history of the world that was ever a POW. He apparently thinks HE is the ONLY person on Earth who can possess that meme.

Perhaps that is where his daughter got this mind set:

He isn’t.

I met Phil Butler over ten years ago and spent some time with him. He was in the Hanoi Hilton eight years. McCain was there five. So HIS opinion should MAYBE count a little bit TOO don’t you think? He is a much more internally spiritual (not religious – there IS a difference) person from that experience.

He never speaks about the negative of it. Only the positive of it.

Yet he could have been tortured and killed at ANY TIME night or day while in a small prison cell for over EIGHT YEARS. He said the greatest moment was the turning point in his soul when he chose to live and not die in his captivity. He is a very gentle and truly spiritual man from his experience. He also has a very good sense of humor which doesn’t really come across in this video due to the subject matter. But he does! Every person here on Mudflats would truly enjoy meeting him very much. A very fine man.

21 09 2008
LEE

I live on Orcas Island in Washington State, and the stop sign at the end of my street has a stop war, stop McCain sticker.
We are a mostly democratic island. We vote by mail in ballot, because we are so rural. It is, in a way like Alaska, but Alaska is more rugged in topography. We do, have two mountains on our island, but they are not very high.

There are only a very few republicans here.

21 09 2008
bas

AnneinWA – I have probably become so cynical by now with all the lies, but I wonder how much (or what position) that woman was offered to give him the dogtags. And anyway, what does that have to do with anything? His handlers told him he needs to lay off the POW stuff and this is a way for people to subliminally think about it. McCain is not the only one who has had “difficult situations.” This is a pet peeve of mine – when people spout out (without being asked) their past troubles. It was over 30 years ago! If you haven’t figured out how to deal with it by now…. He uses it for sympathy and for political reasons. It pisses me off so much that people have to preface everything they say about him with “He was a POW so give him a break.” Life happens. It’s how you deal with it that shows your character. Do you see Biden going around saying “My wife and child died – so give me a break”? Somebody talk me down.

21 09 2008
a møøse once bit my sister « angryXer

[…] credit: AnnieNygmaAK of Wasilla, Alaska, other photos here […]

21 09 2008
AnneinWA

Divatalk (20:33:47) :
You let your husband know that Obama’s life, though it may not have been that of a POW, however to say he has not had to face many difficult situations, is extremely naive.
In Obama’s way, he was a POW of another type. His war was a racial one. And in that war he is still battling it.

@Diva,
I have tried my best to do this in a VERY civil way. My husband does NOT have a racist bone in his body…and God know he can relate to Obama’s life as a poor kid – we both can. His entire family is made up of die-hard Republicans – you know the “We’d vote for Mickey Mouse of he was on the Repub ticket” type.

Divatalk (20:33:47) :
I don’t think it took away from their conversation based on McCain in Iraq and Obama in Nevada. McCain is known for war, Obama is known for the people. Each person will take away from it what they choose.

Last thing I will say is this. If McCain was so touched by the experience in Iraq, why did he initially not support the GI bill and why are our veterans returning home and not being taken care of and are homeless. That doesn’t sound like he cares very much for them to me.

@Divatalk,
These are such good points. We have a son who is an Army pilot. He was once a staunch Republican, following in his father’s footsteps. However, after rotations in Kosovo, Afghanistan, Iraq, Iraq, he is now a much more open-minded person who is leaning toward Obama! I haven’t spoke with him since the Palin pick – I wonder how the thrilla from Wasilla sits with him. Thanks again! I sometimes simply need to talk to like-minded people…

21 09 2008
LJP aka Revolver Trooper

Anne in WA,

I can’t talk you down; I’m up there with you. “His response was that it’s not Obama’s fault that he hasn’t had to face many difficult situations in his life, he wasn’t a prisoner of war and possibly I am expecting too much of him since he hasn’t even been in the Senate very long!”

Why is it so hard for some people to imagine how hard it would be for a young black man raised by a single mother to achieve what Obama has achieved? There is something wrong when people can only imagine one kind of struggle. This is not in any way to diminish McCain’s experiences. But one man’s struggles gave him empathy and concern for those less fortunate; the other man’s struggles led him to abandon his wife, marry a rich woman, and crusade for the rich. I guess I am all for looking at what people do with their lives in total.

21 09 2008
CKMN

Sorry if this has already been posted. Here’s the link to an internal goverment document (obtain by ABC News Investigative Team) which shows that Palin’s chief of staff, Mike Nizich, approved Walt Monegan’s trip to Washington, D.C,
http://abcnews.go.com/images/Blotter/TA.pdf
http://www.abcnews.go.com/Blotter/story?id=5844710&page=1

Palin recently claimed that Mr. Monegan made an unauthorized trip, which was one of the reasons he was fired. This document clearly shows that she LIES…

21 09 2008
LEE

The POW story with McCain has been his life’s work. He was shot down and taken prisioner, but after a few days he agreed to tell the vietnamese what they wanted to know in exchange for medical treatment. He did talk, and made roughly 32 tapes denouncing the US. The worst thing he did was give our military codes to the enemy. They couldn’t understand why casualtys were so high and stopped the air raids. The vietnamese called him the song bird. Most of the vets from that time hate him. He went to Washington and was successful in getting all the records from that time classified, and in the late 1900s closed down the MIA search. His problem solved. He has stood guard ever since.

21 09 2008
Bec in Illinois

bas – I totally agree! Give him a break because he was a POW. Give Palin a break b e c a u s e ? That is two breaks demanded for them, and Obama, we know, has to work 5 times as hard because he is a black man. Go figure.

The interesting thing, most of us are aware of how quiet WWII Vets are about some of the most horrific things they went through. You always hear stories of how they never talk about it, their families barely know. They put it in their past and “soldiered on” with their lives as they felt they were expected to.

But not McCain. Roll it out every time, every way he can. Life ain’t fair.

21 09 2008
katiebegood

Bec in Illinois (20:33:31) :
Annie – my sympathies to you for having a divided household. My daughter does, but I couldn’t handle it. That said, your guy doesn’t sound nasty about it, so that is good. We have 40 some days to help you convince him!

Boy, I sympathize and admire anyone who is a progressive who can be married to a Republican. That’s something I couldn’t do. It would mean that we do not have the same values and I could not be married to someone who had opposite values to mine. Once, in a prior lifetime, I put an ad in the personals. The last line of the ad was “Republicans and smokers need not apply”. It turned out to be a good line because I got a lot of mail from men who were not Republicans who liked my candor.

21 09 2008
Cookie

Message sent to my two senators (link below to email US Senators)

Senator _______________:

This insanity has gone on long enough. It is time for the US Senate to stand TOGETHER, and tell Senator McCain that Gov. Palin is NOT suitable to be a heartbeat away from the Presidency of the United States of America – and selecting her has caused the world to question his judgment and fitness for the Presidency.

http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm

21 09 2008
AnneinWA

laurie (20:47:42) :
Off topic Reply to Annie
Do you want to contact me directly?

Laurie,
I am not far from you. You can post your e-mail address on my site at the forum if you’d like. Having a fellow Mudpuppy nearby would be great!

21 09 2008
VP, Flat Earth Society

You see, the problem is that the Republican party is not what it used to be. Those who are/were diehard Republicans are now aliens in their own party as it has been taken over by very unChristian religious zealots. I’m surprised that all these reputable Republicans haven’t actually started a new party and call it the Real Republican Party and leave the holy-rollers to call theirs “The Second Coming Republican Party”.

21 09 2008
AZtopcat

It just occurred to me that Sarah Palin’s medical woudl show when she was pregnant. Maybe that is why we are stalling?

21 09 2008
AZtopcat

typing is the dark doesn’t work.

21 09 2008
Enjay aka Turbine Yukon

Often times my home is divided – we just laugh and say we cancel each other’s votes

21 09 2008
AnneinWA

HamletsMill aka Rot Pipeline Palin (20:50:51) :
John McCain somehow thinks HE is the ONLY person in the history of the world that was ever a POW. He apparently thinks HE is the ONLY person on Earth who can possess that meme.

I met Phil Butler over ten years ago and spent some time with him. He was in the Hanoi Hilton eight years. McCain was there five. So HIS opinion should MAYBE count a little bit TOO don’t you think? He is a much more internally spiritual (not religious – there IS a difference) person from that experience.

@HamletsMill,
I so agree with you. I have read articles written by Butler. I am sick of JMc selling his POW experience as his “credentials to lead” – show me the CHARACTER to lead, please!

21 09 2008
AZtopcat

I volunteered today to be a poll worker. Local election boards are in need of poll workers and poll watchers. While it is a long day I feel it is worthwhile.
Our wonderful seniors tend to be the only volunteers and they are very uncomfortable with technology. So if anyone can donate their time please do.
We don’t want to have to count hanging chads if this is close.

21 09 2008
AnneinWA

bas (20:54:43) :
I have probably become so cynical by now with all the lies, but I wonder how much (or what position) that woman was offered to give him the dogtags. And anyway, what does that have to do with anything? His handlers told him he needs to lay off the POW stuff and this is a way for people to subliminally think about it.

bas,
I too am that cynical. I am so afraid that he will have some tear-jerking, dog-tag type moment in the debate…and as the mother of a soldier, I mean that with ABSOLUTELY NO DISRESPECT for our brave soldiers. Visuals and symbols matter.

21 09 2008
AnneinWA

LJP aka Revolver Trooper (21:01:17) :
I can’t talk you down; I’m up there with you.

Why is it so hard for some people to imagine how hard it would be for a young black man raised by a single mother to achieve what Obama has achieved? There is something wrong when people can only imagine one kind of struggle.

LJP aka Revolver Trooper,
I don’t think it’s that for my guy. HE has had to struggle for everything in his life too. Ya’ know…some days I think he may be thinking about voting for Obama, but I don’t think he would tell me anyway! He loves jerking my chain too much.

21 09 2008
John McCain

Yeah, you’re right: Obama is in a corner.
That guy will never come to Alaska whereas I will often come and see our industry drill oil.

21 09 2008
short-timer

This is a bit off topic, but I can’t wait for the open thread:

(Tina Fey) shrugged off her resemblance to Gov. Sarah Palin, whom she won raves for portraying on the season premiere of “Saturday Night Live.”

“But then my kids saw her on TV and started saying, ‘Mommy?'” she said.

She was more open about her thoughts on reprising the “SNL” role. As in, she’d prefer not to.

“I want to be done playing this lady Nov. 5,” she said. “So if anybody can help me be done playing this lady Nov. 5, that would be good for me.”

Full story here:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080922/ap_en_ce/emmys_tina_fey;_ylt=AnRLQNGF68BjOkqMo5777SxxFb8C

21 09 2008
winstonsmithcloned

I knew it would be easy to find a reference point for this here it is

LJP aka Revolver Trooper (19:31:12) :
Yeah, “ludicrous” is the word. I am still trying to figure out how McCain can still be in the race at all.

if you too happen to be stuck in that twilight zone feeling, maybe this helps

http://www.salon.com/env/mind_reader/2008/09/22/voter_choice/index.html

21 09 2008
AnneinWA

katiebegood (21:04:14) :
Boy, I sympathize and admire anyone who is a progressive who can be married to a Republican. That’s something I couldn’t do. It would mean that we do not have the same values and I could not be married to someone who had opposite values to mine. Once, in a prior lifetime, I put an ad in the personals. The last line of the ad was “Republicans and smokers need not apply”. It turned out to be a good line because I got a lot of mail from men who were not Republicans who liked my candor.

katiebe,
I just read your post out loud to my husband. He said you probably saved a lot of guys a lot of grief by being so candid! I asked if he was referring to the grief he has suffered, living with me…I DIDN’T SAY THAT! was his response. I am even more touchy (bitchy?) than usual tonight. This election is making me batty.

21 09 2008
SMR

@Kathy 20:33:36 ——–

Thank you thank you thank you thank you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I have said that over & over & over on this site. I have not only asked people not to participate in the poll, but also to send an email to PBS chastising them for such low-brow antics. As I said in my email to them, if they want to draw viewers to their website, they would be better served by having informative reporting/links there, as I suspect that the conservative Republican base is not listening to them or donating to them on quite the same scale as are Democrats!

Mudflats Readers: Here’s the link that Kathy provided: http://www.pbs.org/now/feedback.html

Please don’t vote at the PBS poll, protest instead via that contact link!

21 09 2008
BJ Holland

I just want you all to know up there that for some of us down here in the lower 48, discovering the Alaska progressive blogs has been one of the few terrific upsides of the Palin selection. Thanks for all you do. B.

21 09 2008
Sparky Fungible Commodity Palin

LEE (21:14:02) :

Good news for Obama. The Seattle times has endorsed him for president.
(from LEE on previous thread, but nice ;_)

WOW, Wasilla for Obama! You absolutely rock!

As does Joe Biden’s sister and everyone else associated with Obama/Biden, including MudPuppies….love you AKM and Mudpuppies!

21 09 2008
bas

VPFlat – I think you are right. I like to think that if a Democrat was as f****d up as McCain I wouldn’t try to defend him. I don’t know what I would do – but it doesn’t seem to happen. I’m safe.
To AZtopcat – I could be wrong but I don’t think the VP has to release medical records like the Pres does. I think Biden has released his financial records but not his medical – he has issues there too – but I would love to see sarah’s medical records – I’m like a dog with a bone with that one. There’s something really fishy with her 5th child – and it goes to her character. Just release the damn records! I want to quit chewing on that bone.

21 09 2008
AnneinWA

Bec in Illinois (20:42:05) :
I have a wardrobe suggestion for any Mudflat rallies – check out the boots here:
http://www.like.com/shoes/yellow_rubber_boots?SID=GOO&CID

Bec,
I am ordering a pair tomorrow! Great find…and we can never have too many pairs of rubber boots in Western Washington!

THANKS TO ALL OF YOU FOR TALKING ME DOWN AND LIFTING ME UP!

21 09 2008
Eyes Wide Open in Pittsburgh

I am trying to figure out Sarah Palin.

She has a downs syndrome infant, a pregnant teen daughter and (according to the Enquirer) her oldest two children (Bristol and Track) are alledgedly drug users. …Yet in the midst of all this, with her family in crisis, she agrees to run for VP?

I can only conculde that she is a pathological narcissist. What is scary is that a narcisist not only is selfish, but does not see the world as others see it. They operate with a self rightous skewed reality of their very own.

Below is an excerpt from wikipedea:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissistic_personality_disorder

“To the extent that people are pathologically narcissistic, they can be controlling, blaming, self-absorbed, intolerant of others’ views, unaware of others’ needs and of the effects of their behavior on others, and insistent that others see them as they wish to be seen [4]. They may also demand certain behavior from their children because they see the children as extensions of themselves, and need the children to represent them in the world in ways that meet the parents’ emotional needs [7]. (For example, a narcissistic father who was a lawyer demanded that his son, who had always been treated as the “favorite” in the family, enter the legal profession as well. When the son chose another career, the father rejected and disparaged him.)”

“These traits will lead overly narcissistic parents to be very intrusive in some ways, and entirely neglectful in others. The children are punished if they do not respond adequately to the parents’ needs. This punishment may take a variety of forms, including physical abuse, angry outbursts, blame, attempts to instill guilt, emotional withdrawal, and criticism. Whatever form it takes, the purpose of the punishment is to enforce compliance with the parents’ narcissistic needs[7].”

“People who are overly narcissistic commonly feel rejected, humiliated and threatened when criticised. To protect themselves from these dangers, they often react with disdain, rage, and/or defiance to any slight criticism, real or imagined [8]. To avoid such situations, some narcissistic people withdraw socially and may feign modesty or humility.”

“Though individuals with NPD are often ambitious and capable, the inability to tolerate setbacks, disagreements or criticism, along with lack of empathy, make it difficult for such individuals to work cooperatively with others or to maintain long-term professional achievements [9]. With narcissistic personality disorder, the person’s perceived fantastic grandiosity, often coupled with a hypomanic mood, is typically not commensurate with his or her real accomplishments.”

“The exploitativeness, sense of entitlement, lack of empathy, disregard for others, and constant need for attention inherent in NPD adversely affect interpersonal relationships.”

21 09 2008
Divatalk

Ok guys, I am going to bed. Its almost 2AM here on the east.
I will chat with you guys tomorrow. I am working on that solidarity
shirt. We should comeup with a day to do a national movement
for Obama/Biden to show the repubs we are taking back our country!

Peace!

21 09 2008
portland oregon native

I too Watched 60 Minutes, and the whole dog tag thing mad me want to throw up! If JSM is so concerned about the troops then why doesn’t he get off his high horse and tell us exactly HOW he intends to end this senseless war, that he voted for, end torture, and bring our troops home and care for them once they are back.
And it looks to me like he’s been livin’ pretty good in Sedona. Can you imagine how much water all that lawn takes in August???
Same goes for the economic issues. Mister regulator my a$$!
What a hypocrite!
Annie have your hubby read the Newsweek article referenced earlier here and watch the ABC clip also. When George Will says he “nervous” and that McCain is not presidential, I am encouraged.
Watched our local PBS station that had a Pavarotti special. What a voice! Magic. I almost forgot the current troubles.

21 09 2008
ND aka Chase Rooster Palin

Another Reason to Vote Obama/Biden

You might find this interesting:
An obituary notice that appeared in Sri Lanka’s English language daily newspaper, the Ceylon Daily News, of March 22, 1974.

“O’CRACY – The death occurred under tragic circumstances of D E M O’CRACY, beloved husband of T Ruth, loving father of L I Bertie, brother of Faith and Justice. Interred on Saturday, 20th inst – Araliya Medura, Panagiyawatte, Anduruwala.”

(Aailya Medura – reference to the Temple Trees, the official residence of the prime minister; Panagiyawatte – the land of the dead or dying; Anduruwala – land of darkness) The obituary notice was the harbinger of events to follow.

We have recovered by now, and it was not such a disaster as predicted. I believe democracy is still alive over here. Please make sure you dont need to copy this obit for your State and the nation after the election.

ChaseRooster

21 09 2008
bas

EyesWide – That seems to fit her personality. I know we are not supposed to talk about how a woman v. a man deals with their kids – but damnit! – I expect more from a woman because we have to be concerned about our kids (if we don’t do it, who will?) And they are our future. We are not at the point in time yet that we can trust men to do it.

21 09 2008
Harley Pinocchio Palin :Palins Kick Ass Conscience

Divatalk (21:47:49) :

Ok guys, I am going to bed. Its almost 2AM here on the east.
I will chat with you guys tomorrow. I am working on that solidarity
shirt. We should comeup with a day to do a national movement
for Obama/Biden to show the repubs we are taking back our country!

Peace!
===================================

Me too Diva…see you good Mudflatians tomorrow

21 09 2008
Meleana aka StagTunnelPalin

TeachKids-

sorry off topic

Spent a fun morning and part of this evening watching the sign in your yard. Give your boy a hug for us– (and my daughter thinks he’s cool)

Small acts can be big.

21 09 2008
Debbie aka Commando Coalfire Palin

LEE (20:54:17) :

I live on Orcas Island in Washington State, and the stop sign at the end of my street has a stop war, stop McCain sticker.
———Ah Orcas Island, how is good old Orcas. My Uncle had a farm at West Sound we used to spend most of our summers working for him. This was before it had alot of tourists. I imagine Orcas would have alot of Obama supporters, unless it’s changed most people are very down to earth and practical and anyone who is practical would never vote for McCain.

21 09 2008
sfmama

Go to PBS website and vote NO now. Poll now shows more people think Palin is qualified to be president than don’t. Ugh!

PBS poll

21 09 2008
HamletsMill aka Rot Pipeline Palin

I am a member of VFP (Veterans For Peace) like several other veterans here on Mudflats. It was founded in 1986 mainly from the grief of a veteran whose brother had been killed in Vietnam. It was his way of trying to find meaning in that loss all the years later. I have been a member since 1990. Here is a slide show of the IVAW (Iraq Veterans Against the War) and VFP demos at the RNC which got no coverage from the corporate MSM whatsoever. But they are out there. The MFSO (Military Famlies Speak Out) also. If you have never heard of these groups, just Google them.

If you are tired, look at the faces just like the women of the Alaskan Anti-Palin Rally with their guys and their children.

Look at the faces.

http://minnesotaindependent.com/6511/iraq-vets-against-the-war-march-kicks-off-rnc-day-one

I’m up too damn late again, but was going through my e-mail just now to catch up and had been sent this link.

Good night here! Good morning to everyone in Europe! And Good day to everyone in Oz!

21 09 2008
GJ in Idaho

Obama rallies on 60 min. I’m always just so impressed with how he presents himself, in so many different situations. Palin and McClain take multiple hits on the Emmy’s tonight. So many laughs, and even more serious statements and clips.

I really was touched when Obama when back to talk to the woman that had yelled at him during the time he’d step away from the crowd and it turned out to be an older lady who’s husband had just passed away. He seemed so gentle and kind with her.

I don’t mean to slight the mother who’s letter McClain just happened to get before the interview. But his showing her sons picture and his dog tags like that just made my husband steaming mad. He said a true Vet would never use another guy’s tags like that, especially today when so little is shown of those whose lives are lost and wounded every day. He also said he would have some respected for McPow if he’d actually done something to help the vet’s in so many of the Vet’s hospitals that are still poorly staff and are so much in need of repair all across America, or even if he’d been seen making sure the men in active duty had the equipment they need in the field.

We actually kind of felt sorry for McGramps when he was trying to look outdoorsy, and pointed to that cliff as if it was something he climbed everyday. I had thought perhaps we were really going to get to see one of his favorite houses but no not even a tiny long distance shot. What really took the cake was when he said something about if he was president he would not move into the White house but move his office to the GOP office. Is this an idea he got from Palin? Hey, no need to move into the big house. Or has he already decided to give it to her, while she is in Washington DC. After all she only has one house and he has 7 or maybe 8, if only he could remember.

Wow, Johnny MacNut has gone completely off his rocker.

21 09 2008
Charles

Palin made her Florida fans wait for 4 to 5 hours in heat that was in the 90s. Then, she spoke for all of 23 minutes. Impressive. NOT!

If I were a Palin fan, I’d be resentful of being served such an empty sandwich. But perhaps I expect more than they do.

21 09 2008
AnneinWA

portland oregon native (21:54:49) :
I too Watched 60 Minutes, and the whole dog tag thing mad me want to throw up! If JSM is so concerned about the troops then why doesn’t he get off his high horse and tell us exactly HOW he intends to end this senseless war, that he voted for, end torture, and bring our troops home and care for them once they are back.
And it looks to me like he’s been livin’ pretty good in Sedona. Can you imagine how much water all that lawn takes in August???
Same goes for the economic issues. Mister regulator my a$$!
What a hypocrite!
Annie have your hubby read the Newsweek article referenced earlier here and watch the ABC clip also. When George Will says he “nervous” and that McCain is not presidential, I am encouraged.

Hello Portland Or,
I am so pleased to hear that I am not the only person who reacted that way to McCain tonight. I accuse my husband of being closed-minded and ask him to listen closely to Obama (I even asked him to listen to something on Keith Olberman last week – he looked at me like I was nuts. Hey, I watch the O’Reilly ranter when he asks!). However, I realize my mind is closed this election. No Way…No How…No McCain
BTW, we also heard George Will this morning. There was a great article on HuffPo about the “ripping” JohnnyMc got on that show today from both Will and Donaldson. Thanks for your encouraging words!

21 09 2008
AnneinWA

GJ in Idaho (22:14:57) :
I don’t mean to slight the mother who’s letter McClain just happened to get before the interview. But his showing her sons picture and his dog tags like that just made my husband steaming mad. He said a true Vet would never use another guy’s tags like that, especially today when so little is shown of those whose lives are lost and wounded every day.

GJ,
I just read your post and I am feeling better. Earlier this evening I posted my thoughts (rants!) about 60 minutes and fellow Mudflatters have been responding in support all evening. BLESS THEM! My post was AnneinWA (20:14:47)

21 09 2008
Palmdale, CA

Can anyone tell me how one gets to be a poll worker? I’m really torn between trying to work locally (CA will go blue even if my area doesn’t) and going to try to work in a battleground state to get people out and drag them to the polls if necessary. (Figuratively, of course, but I’ll drive, babysit, whatever!)

21 09 2008
Ky Fork Decoy Palin

HamletsMill aka Rot Pipeline Palin (22:10:46) :
Thank you so much for sharing those moving images! It’s sad that in this election, it is up to the citizens to spread the news, because the MSM won’t do it for us. I am confident we can make these viral for you, though.🙂

I am passing the link along to others.

21 09 2008
kim

Another Sarah Palin experience poll. Go vote you guys cause we are losing.

http://www.pbs.org/now/polls/poll-435.html

21 09 2008
Aussie Puck Mule Revlon Red Palin

Charles (22:19:07) :

Palin made her Florida fans wait for 4 to 5 hours in heat that was in the 90s. Then, she spoke for all of 23 minutes. Impressive. NOT!

If I were a Palin fan, I’d be resentful of being served such an empty sandwich. But perhaps I expect more than they do.

I wonder what the MSM will make of it. Probably nothing.

21 09 2008
C

C aka Filter Skate Palin 😀

——-

Palmdale, CA (22:28:07) :
Can anyone tell me how one gets to be a poll worker? I’m really torn between trying to work locally (CA will go blue even if my area doesn’t) and going to try to work in a battleground state to get people out and drag them to the polls if necessary. (Figuratively, of course, but I’ll drive, babysit, whatever!)

… Hey, if you are in Palmdale you can help with “Drive for Change”. Each weekend they are bus-ing people to Nevada to help with the swing state. If you have that kind of time, that would be a great cause. Otherwise, you can just help out at your local Democratic office with general admin stuff. Last week I helped put together neighborhood leader packets, etc. They also need help phone banking, etc. Just call your local office and they can help you get started!

21 09 2008
Aussie Puck Mule Revlon Red Palin

@Palmdale, CA (22:28:07) :

Can anyone tell me how one gets to be a poll worker?

Palmdale, to be a poll worker I believe you have to be registered to vote in the state you want to work in. Certainly that is the case for NV and CA.

If you want to volunteer in another state, I’m sure the nearest CA Obama office can help you out with the relevant information.

Good luck!🙂

21 09 2008
Aussie Puck Mule Revlon Red Palin

snap, C!😉

21 09 2008
C

Hi Aussie!

You’re missing all the fun! Check out this chat/video stream!

http://www.ustream.tv/channel/obama-sign-cctv-1

Teachpoverty in Oregon had her Obama sign stolen a few times so she put a up live video camera to catch the culprit. The cool thing is, a lot of Mudflatters are chatting on that site now.

21 09 2008
Palmdale, CA

Someone over on the Mudflats Forum had the perfect response to people who say they wouldn’t or couldn’t vote for a black man….

“if you were drowning, and a black person was the only one with a life preserver to throw you, would you take it?”

An interesting analogy that SHOULD provide an opportunity to ponder…

21 09 2008
bas

George Will? Dan Fagan? Lyda Green? You gotta give em credit!

21 09 2008
bas

I think if you want to be a poll worker, you call your Division of Elections, or whatever they call it in your state. BTW you get paid for doing it. In Alaska it’s more that minimum wage.

21 09 2008
Palmdale, CA

@ Cavegal
I’m not at all convinced of your reasoning on the rally… I’ve also heard that it was people who’d sold short (bet the fall would continue) having to cover their shorts given the new SEC rules. We’ll have to wait and see what happens.

21 09 2008
Ky Fork Decoy Palin

For anyone who is awake, come watch the sign with us! haha!
http://www.ustream.tv/channel/obama-sign-cctv-1

This family has had 2 signs stolen, and finally the 16 y/o son set up a camera to catch the thief!

21 09 2008
angryxer

ok, this is O/T, but since AKM doesn’t seem to be posting an open thread tonight, here goes:

as much as i’ve appreciated andrew sullivan’s posts of late, he is now bugging the hell out of me. particularly on bill maher the other night, cutting off naomi klein’s excellent points on “disaster capitalism”– what gov’t & corporations can get away with in times of crisis that they never would be able to otherwise. if any of you have seen the shocking treasury proposal that gives complete power without oversight to the secretary for two years to do as he sees fits, you’ll see the immediate implications for the bailout. i posted one of klein’s interviews with some current context here: http://angryxer.wordpress.com/2008/09/21/the-hour-naomi-klein/
i’m running out to buy her book, and i hope you do too.

g’night, mudflatters.

21 09 2008
GJ in Idaho

Hi AnneinWA: Glad I could cheer you up some.

Did I actually miss a shot of one of McCain’s houses? I did step out of the room to stir some plum jelly for a few minutes, I thought I just missed the commercial.

I’m still shaking my head over the White House thing. Can you imagine your Pres doing the busness of the country in the GOP headquarters? So where is the war room going to be? This guy just comes from the strangest place.

21 09 2008
Andrea

@ Palmdale – I don’t know about poll working but I do know that this place needs volunteers and helpers –

http://www.866ourvote.org/

– I’d encourage all ye Mudflatians to sign up if you can (and/or to pass that link on to anyone you know studying or working in law). If I could, I would. It’s so bloody frustrating being over here in Britain and being ble to do so little!!

(that said, I am off to an ‘Obama London’ supporters meet-up tonight, so will report back!)

21 09 2008
Hick Town in W PA

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/09/21/AR2008092102546.html?hpid=topnews

Check out the fluff article on Todd Palin at WAPO. I want to know how he can be a stay at home dad if he is also the co-Governor. Duh!

21 09 2008
Hick Town in W PA

…..http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/09/21/AR2008092102546.html?hpid=topnews….

Check out the fluff article on Todd Palin at WAPO. I want to know how you can be a “stay-at-home” dad and co-Governor at the same time.

22 09 2008
short-timer

Mudflaters: Thanks for the tip about the 60 Minutes interviews. I don’t watch TV, but was able to catch it on-line. I only saw about 3-4 minutes of McCain and couldn’t stand to watch it anymore. He doesn’t seem very lucid to me. I watched just one segment on Obama and, wow, he is a good communicator! As an Alaskan living in the Middle East, I must also say that I think he is right on about the war in Iraq. Just for the record, I’m a registered non-partisan with Republican history.

22 09 2008
Soldotna Sue

Hi Hick Town in W PA

I’ll tell you how the co-governor Todd can watch the kids and do his co-governing. Sarah refuses to go to the state capitol in Juneau. She chooses to work from her home in Wasilla and drive to her Anchorage office. The poor state workers in Juneau have been going around with “Where is Sarah?” buttons for almost two years now. The Governor’s mansion is unoccupied! She is so lame!

22 09 2008
short-timer

If Sarah ever has the chance to run again for governor, all her opponent would have to say is, “I pledge to occupy the Governor’s mansion” and he/she would win by a landslide.

22 09 2008
Hick Town in W PA

@Soldotna Sue
So why did the state OK funding to redecorate the Gov mansion and let Todd be in charge. What are his credentials in the area aside from being a bully and rip-off artist?

I voted for Fast Eddy while holding my nose, but his wife is a working judge and doesn’t get involved in the state.

22 09 2008
Hick Town in W PA

Check out http://www.bsf4o.com/index.php Military families for Obama

22 09 2008
nearlynormalized

It thills me to see the world knowing Obama is the one, why can’t we who know what is going on in this country get over ourselves and have dialog first and war as the finalality not the first choice. I am an old, white dyke that loves the change I feel and the change that is transpiring–Obama for life and living.
Thank you.

22 09 2008
disgustedfemale

Went to women for Obama rally in Erie Pa.
Saw my very first boss, from 40 years ago., speak..asked her if she remembered me ha ha

then worked in erie all day, door to door…plan to go to edinboro next sat..Just trying to help my neighbor states…will go to Ohio if needed

There is a person from Ca that has organized a postcard campaign…to send personal postcards to people in Ohio…if interested go to obama site
think we could all help with this one…write while waiting in line, waiting for kids to get out of school, etc…sounds pretty easy to me

22 09 2008
Lacy Lady

Hope everyone gets the New News out today.
NYT: Mccain chief of staff/lobbyist was paid $2m by Fannie and Freddie for access to MCain and to stop REGULATION of banking industry.
Senator John McCain’s campaign manager was paid more than $30,000.00 a month for five years as president of an advocacy group set up by the mortgage giants Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to defend them against stricter regulations, current and former officials say……….
read the rest of the story…….www.americablog.com/2008/09/nyt-mccain-chief-of-stafflobbyist-was.html Also read about the big pipe line to nowhere. $50M State money—invested—They will be fighting for land in Canada owned by the Indians—big time—could be Years. http://www.newsweek.com/id/160088
WE MUST VOTE Obama/Biden 08
God Bless America

22 09 2008
disgustedfemale

Oh..I too watched the 60 min last night. First thought if I were a Republican I would be pretty mad…he blamed them for all the economic mess (disaster) that we are in now…

I just sent email to Andrew Cuomo, the attorney general of my state. I am interested in his response to McCain stating that if he gets elected he would put Cuomo in as SEC…will report back if I get an answer

Just watched that roundtable that was on ABC…thanks for the link

In all seriousness….do you think McCain is losing it?? having a mental breakdown??? The things coming out of his mouth these days are crazy even by Rep standards

22 09 2008
Pat

bas……….
Biden ( A MAN) did it very successfully after the death of his wife and daughter! WHile commuting to DC and being a Senator! I realize that his sister made a significant contribution in raising those two boys until he remarried…but neither palin or first dude seem to be doing much for their brood!
My Mother was a narcissist. I RECOGNIZED in the first 5 minutes of national exposure,
the pain/discomfort of those palin kids…………………….Like Bristol I had to get married at 18 ( just past 17), my initiative, to get away from my home life, and the pressure of my Mother living through me.
Mainiac, I am here in Downeast Maine on the coast, an expaite from NJ/Philly.
I can’t find a way to type my info onto forum. can anyone help me there?

22 09 2008
Roschelle

A recently published article I found this morning on McCain’s market-based healthcare planand a video of him expressing his stand on deregulation along with a bonus! He mentions the bridge to nowhere!!!!

22 09 2008
jean beverly

this is a poll asking ‘do you think sarah palin is qualified to be vice
president?’ and conservatives have organized a yes vote. take a minute
to tell them differently.

> http://www.pbs.org/now/polls/poll-435.html

22 09 2008
Tom from PA

To: AnnieinWA

Please ask your husband for me what he learned from those hardships. Did his experiences in Vietnam teach him that “War is Hell” and should only be resorted to as a mehod of last resort? I think not. Did he protest the invasion of Iraq when the UN and our Allies did? How about when the links of Bin Laden to Hussein were proved false?,,,did his experiences help then?…or when the evidence of WMD were all proving false? Which experience did he draw from?..his war experiences or his alcoholism? He is th biggest hawk in Congress…his experiences mean absolutely nothing unless he learned from them
Do not even get me started on what he learned from his Keating 5 days and the current economic crisis.

22 09 2008
Laughing No Longer...

g’mornin’ muddies!
hi – 2 questions,,

i saw on cnn headline news that wasilla made victims pay for rape kits, but “there is no proof that mayor palin knew about it”
anybody got the proof? needs to go to cnn.

2nd- any gatherings planned for nyc tomorrow – as we know that meeting a few dignitaries will qualify as scarah’s foreign policy experience.
she’s meeting bono too, maybe then she will be a rock star too? i think its insulting that he will meet with her. maybe she should go be v-p of ireland, after all she was there for 25 minutes refueling once. how would bono like that?

22 09 2008
AnneinWA

Tom from PA (07:02:53) :
Please ask your husband for me what he learned from those hardships. Did his experiences in Vietnam teach him that “War is Hell” and should only be resorted to as a mehod of last resort?

Tom from PA,
Believe me Tom, we have had all the discussions you mentioned. It has been 8 years of “HOT TOPICS” at our house, especially since I was so opposed to Bush/Cheney before elected. I had followed the folks at the Project for the New American Century:

http://www.newamericancentury.org/

and I knew they were SCARY! So…my mantra in 2000 was – ‘elect Bush and prepare for a war in Iraq!’ I truly DO NOT enjoy saying “I told you so”. Our poor country, military, economy (which = the American people and our reputation throughout the world) have suffered so much under this “reign of terror”.

22 09 2008
SMR

@ Laughing No Longer

Someone here in Alaska (wish I could remember who), some staffer that is, has already said that Mayor scarah would not allow the city to pay for them because they contain the morning after pill. Perhaps a google on that will suffice? I’ll give it a shot later.

@Jean Beverly

That poll issue has been a hot one here. My suggestion (as was suggested by others) over a dozen times has been NOT to vote there but to instead submit an email to them expressing your disgust with their suddenly low-brow antics. PBS is known for quality programming & is supported in large part by donations. I somehow suspect that the icky religious right who so vehemently opposed the gay teletubbie are not the ones who are sending in donations! That poll is not scientific, people can vote over & over & over, it has obviously been hijacked and has no credibility whatsoever, so ignore the poll & let them know how you feel about their crap poll via their online form. I believe the comment exchanges between myself & another are at the top of these comment (with link), and I have been stating my position on this stupid poll on several other threads as well. The poll is compromised, it is no longer of any use except so that PBS can draw people in to their website.

Finally, now on to what I was here for………

Here’s a link to a Florida letter to the editor forum: http://www.tbo.com/news/opinion/submissionform.htm

Of course it comes as no surprise to anyone here to know that the numbers reported by the McCain staff were more than double what was estimated by the local paper. Check out the article here: http://www2.tbo.com/content/2008/sep/22/na-florida-fans-break-sweat-at-palin-rally/

Read the article & send a letter to the editor! LET’S TURN FLORIDA BLUE!!!!!!!!!!!!!

22 09 2008
SMR

Forgot to comment on the washington post article!

I read that last night and noticed a big fat lie from Meg Stapleton on the first page! She talks about icky creepy todd being so involved because he’s gone so often for his job on the slope, so making up for it when he’s in town…

Wait wait wait!!!!!!!!! Am I the only one in Alaska that remembers that he was to have taken a leave of absence from his slope job with BP while scarah was Gov? As far as I know he’s not been to work on the slope since she started her day job as gov of our fine state.

22 09 2008
StellaFurjanic

Hi, from Tallahassee, Florida! Michelle Obama and Jill Biden are coming to our city this weekend!!! I was most fortunate to have a moment to speak with Michelle Obama when she was previously here. If that opportunity arises again, I would love to let her know that there is Alaska support for the Obama/Biden ticket!!!

22 09 2008
girldujour

Did you see that Bloomberg weighs in, not surprisingly in favor of Obama?

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601070&sid=alfUj1r0Z10o&refer=politics

22 09 2008
Riverside

I heard a rumor that the Federal Government plans to nationalize the oil industry to pay for the financial industry bailout. But, seriously, when a private citizen applies for a loan, they must prove they have the income to pay it back (now that nodoc loans are out) or put up collateral to cover it. So what is the collateral or income proof on this 700 billion? The fed income is generally thought to come from taxes. This implies 700 billion in new taxes. The other alternative is collateral. So what is the collateral backing this 700 billion?
Is it the gold in Fort Knox? Is it the military might of the U.S., which gives the feds the ability to invade and plunder 700 billion from another country? Is it the brilliant robust future of the U.S. economy, which will generate the 700 Billion in new tax revenue without raising taxes? Is it the national social security fund (interesting thought)? Is it the next 20 years of every entitlement program from medicare to public health funding? Is it medical care for our veterans? Is it our federal highway system (no more tollfree roads to anywhere)? Is it our federal lands(sell them off to the highest, or lowest but politically connected bidder)? Is it our public school system(sell the schools off to private contractors who then get to charge what they want in student tuition)?

Just think, what is the collateral? Right now, the Bush proposal looks like one more big handout to the rich on his way out of the White House. Closing shop firesale from an outgoing administration, last gift to friends and supporters. Hurry up and socialize those losses while we are still in power.
Is this the real cost of taking impeachment off the table?

Obviously I am suffering the effects of shock and awe.

22 09 2008
The Rogue Jew

Obama will have to prepare his giant ego for the day when Palin/McCain hand him and Biden their asses on November 5th. My prediction is that Obama will lose huge like Carter did in 1980…Prepare the koolaide Obamabots…Your Jonestown is upon you!

22 09 2008
elie

Hi all..I just thought I would let you know we had 300 people at a rally in Windsor Ontario Canada supporting Obama. The rally was organized by Americans who now live in Canada. It was very spirited and a lot of fun….even for the Canadians like me in the group!

22 09 2008
plectroria

.

22 09 2008
Sam aka Blaster Commando Palin

someone (an independent) sent me an article blasting the dems contribution to the current economic meltdown and asked me why i’m voting for obama – here are my reasons why:

it’s true that politics is tangled and both sides bought into the deregulation frenzy. some regulation is good, as is some deregulation. the middle path. i can see that what seems popular at the time can motivate politicians to vote for it, either for future votes from their constituents or for financial contributions.

the economy is a mess, yet there are also many other issues that are important to consider in this election.

as you can tell, i’m a democrat. i do not agree with everything the party does, yet the basic philosophy of helping others, protecting our environment, and peaceful co-existence with the rest of the world are my values, too.

the wild lies about obama raising taxes (actually only the for higher income/wealthy, not the middle and lower incomes), and the outright racial intolerance (also from white dems), as well as the cynical lack of respect the republican leaders (and some followers) have shown, really makes me feel disgusted. the blatant manipulation of peoples’ fears and prejudices is so ugly. if you read the last article i sent (the one by sam harris of newsweek), one of the points he made makes a lot of sense: why would you want the best surgeon, teacher, lawyer, electrician, but not the best-qualified person for president? how can who you want to have a beer with be our voting criteria? it’s crazy.

obama is no saint – he is a politician and must navigate the murky waters of politics as much as any other politician. yet, obama has not stooped to below-the-belt punches. he has also stretched or exaggerated the truth, but not made outright complete lies about his opponent.

i like what he stands for – helping others – not handouts – but finding ways to help people help themselves, such as through furthering their education, whether it’s college or vocational training.

i like giving tax breaks to us regular folks and increasing taxes on the wealthy so they pay their fair share and are not ducking through tax loopholes which are not available to the average wage-earner.

i don’t mind paying a fair tax because it pays for infrastructure and programs that we need. i wish we could designate where our taxes go – have a form that we can check off every year to send in with our tax returns. none of my money would go to the war. i’d choose healthcare, education and the environment.

i like that he supports universal healthcare – maybe hillary’s plan was better – i don’t know, i’m not financial wiz. it’s ridiculous that we are the only first world country that doesn’t provide healthcare for all our citizens. republicans seems to be all about privatization and deregulation for all industries regardless of the consequences. as you say, moderation is the key. all-government or all private sector is either too bureaucratic or too profit-driven.

i agree with his views on using diplomacy, and war being a last-resort.

i am pro-choice. abortion sucks, but people will have sex and some will have unexpected pregnancies. i don’t like abortion, but i uphold other people’s right to make their own choices.

the social conservatives want to tell everyone else how to live – their way. at the same time, the say they don’t want government involved in their personal lives. it’s a double-standard.

i’m for preservation and protection of our environment. if we mess it up, we have to live with polluted air, water, land. that’s no way to live, so let’s keep it clean for ourselves and for the generations to come.

i think wolves and polar bears have as much right as we do to live on this planet. sarah palin doesn’t.

whew🙂 back to work!

22 09 2008
Chris Portela

I’ve just looked at some of the reviews of Sarah Palin in FL. MSNBC indicates there were several thousand people. She did her standard speech with some variation to include the economic crisis from last week. She did not take questions from audience or reporters.

People were enthusiastic. They didn’t really have any concrete reason except they liked her.

Meanwhile, Joe Biden was in FL with a couple of thousand people. He answered questions from audience and reporters

Tell me again why everyone keeps saying the American people are smart?

And you see what exactly in obama? The presidential candidate. Sarah palin? has enough experience to be a VP. understand being a Governor of any state is a whole lot more important than any “community organizer” job OR even being in the senate for 143 days and never writing a single piece of legislation and coming back after votes to change his vote to the side that won(if he lost)

24 09 2008
whitehawk

I desparately want you all to think about Obama as a choice, he is a good man with a warm heart, intelligent, high integrity, ambitious, compassionate…he really is like Ted Kennedy and Caroline said………men like this only come around every 50 – 100 years, he has what it needs. He has fortitude , endurance…look at him amost 2 yrs of campaigning, for you and I,…everyone. Globally they adore him, his style, straight forward answers and calm. His temperament is so great for anyone. McCain is in with corruption so much, involved with the scandals now opening to the public…he is part of that but is such a good liar as Palin, they leave doubt.

Cheer up Alaskans; I’m praying Obama will win and your state will be a state of plenty for everyone, not just a few.




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